Microsoft MVP Evi van der Velden joins the M365.fm podcast to explain why simplicity is one of the most overlooked success factors in Microsoft 365. The conversation explores how many organizations create unnecessary complexity through excessive customization, unclear governance, and overengineered solutions that ultimately reduce productivity instead of improving it.

Evi shares practical insights from real-world Microsoft 365 projects, highlighting how simpler architectures, cleaner collaboration environments, and focused governance strategies often deliver better long-term results. The discussion covers Microsoft Teams, SharePoint, governance, adoption, user experience, and the growing impact of AI tools like Microsoft Copilot inside modern workplaces.

A key theme throughout the episode is that technology should support people rather than force users to adapt to complicated systems. Evi explains why organizations frequently underestimate the importance of user behavior, communication, and change management when deploying Microsoft 365 solutions.

The episode also dives into common mistakes businesses make when scaling Microsoft 365 environments, including creating too many Teams, poorly structured SharePoint sites, and governance models that become difficult to maintain. Instead of adding more tools and processes, Evi advocates for clarity, consistency, and intentional design decisions that help employees work more efficiently.

This conversation provides valuable guidance for IT professionals, architects, and business leaders looking to simplify their Microsoft 365 environments while improving adoption, governance, and long-term usability.

Simplicity wins in Microsoft 365 because it cuts through confusion and helps you get up to speed faster. When you focus on user-centric design, you put your needs first and make every task easier.

Our design philosophy puts the user—an employee or guest—at the heart of every decision we make at Microsoft Digital. This helps us align all facility services (both physical and digital) with the needs of our people and our company culture. The goal of this approach is to make tasks that might have previously caused friction in an employee’s day simpler and easier.

With so many features rolling out and tools everywhere, it’s easy to feel overwhelmed. When you choose simplicity, you give yourself a better chance to thrive in your Microsoft 365 environment.

Key Takeaways

Simplicity in Microsoft 365 helps you work faster and reduces confusion. Focus on user-friendly tools to enhance your experience.
Avoid overwhelming yourself with too many features. Stick to essential apps like Teams, SharePoint, and Outlook to boost productivity.
Frequent updates can be challenging. Concentrate on the tools you use daily to minimize confusion during changes.
Limit customizations to keep your system easy to manage. Too many tweaks can complicate updates and slow down performance.
Invest in user training to empower your team. Well-trained users feel confident and can use Microsoft 365 effectively.
Establish clear governance rules to manage access and permissions. This keeps your data secure and your team organized.
Automate routine tasks to save time and reduce errors. Start small with simple workflows to improve efficiency.
Create a culture of simplicity by recognizing complexity and encouraging clear communication among your team.

Complexity Challenges in Microsoft 365

Microsoft 365 gives you a powerful set of tools, but sometimes the sheer number of options can feel like too much. Let’s break down the main challenges you might face when things get complicated.

Overwhelming Features

You open Microsoft 365 and see a long list of apps—Teams, SharePoint, Outlook, OneDrive, and more. Each one offers dozens of features. You might wonder, “Which tool should I use for this task?” This confusion is common. Many people struggle to pick the right app or feature, which slows down work and creates frustration.

Rapid Updates

Microsoft 365 updates often. New features appear, menus change, and icons move. You might log in one day and see something new, even if you just got used to the old setup. These frequent changes can make it hard to keep up, especially if you don’t have time for extra training.

Tip: Focusing on the essential tools you use every day can help you avoid feeling lost when updates roll out.

Tool Fatigue

When you have too many choices, it’s easy to feel overwhelmed. This is called the “paradox of choice.” You might end up using only a few tools, even though others could help you work better. Sometimes, less is more.

Common Pitfalls

Even with the best intentions, you can run into trouble if you try to do too much at once.

Over-customization

Customizing Microsoft 365 can seem like a good idea. You want your tools to fit your exact needs. But too many tweaks can backfire. Over-customization makes your system harder to maintain. It can slow down performance and make upgrades tricky. You might also spend more money and time than you planned.

Maintenance gets complicated as custom solutions pile up.
Performance can drop if customizations don’t scale well.
Technical debt grows, making future changes harder.
Budgets can spiral out of control with too many custom features.

Integration Overload

Connecting lots of apps and services sounds smart, but it can create new headaches. Here’s a quick look at the risks:

Risk Type	Description
Inappropriate technology choice	Picking the wrong tech can make integrations clunky and frustrating.
Data security risks	More connections mean more chances for data to leak or get exposed.
Storage costs and platform limits	Too much data can push you over limits, leading to extra costs or slower service.
Network latency	Integrations can slow down if data takes too long to move between apps.
Anti-patterns	Poor integration habits can cause errors and performance issues.
Proprietary technology	Using unsupported partner tech can delay projects and add risk.
Readiness	If your team isn’t trained, you might pick the wrong tools or miss out on better options.

Note: Evi van der Velden, a Microsoft MVP, highlights that strong governance and user training are key to overcoming these challenges. When you focus on helping people understand the tools and set clear rules, you make Microsoft 365 work for everyone.

If you keep things simple and focus on what matters most, you can avoid these common traps and get the most out of Microsoft 365.

Why Simplicity Wins in Microsoft 365

Accelerated Onboarding

When you join a new team or start using a new tool, you want to get up and running fast. Built-in simplicity in Microsoft 365 helps you do just that. You don’t have to spend weeks learning complicated systems. Instead, you can jump right in and start working.

A regional manufacturer switched to a Microsoft 365 intranet and saw a 30% drop in internal emails. People found what they needed faster.
The HR team used Power Apps to speed up onboarding. What used to take weeks now takes just a few days.

Simplicity wins because it removes barriers. You don’t waste time searching for documents or figuring out where to click. With easy-to-use tools, you feel confident from day one.

Enhanced Productivity

You want to get more done in less time. That’s where built-in simplicity really shines. When Microsoft 365 is set up in a straightforward way, you spend less time troubleshooting and more time focusing on your work.

Here’s how simplifying your setup can impact productivity:

Negative Impact on Productivity	Description
Connectivity Issues	Complex configurations can lead to reduced availability and performance of Microsoft 365 services, negatively affecting user experience.
Operational Efficiency	Streamlined configurations help in minimizing network management complexities, thus enhancing overall operational efficiency.

When you keep things simple, you avoid slowdowns and confusion. You can use SharePoint to find documents quickly. AI-driven search gives you results that match what you need. Image tagging and taxonomy tagging make it easy to organize and discover content. You don’t have to dig through folders or remember complicated file names.

“Discoverability is always at the front of our minds and making content easy to find requires time and effort in SharePoint.”

With features like autofill columns and document processing, you save time on manual tasks. Optical character recognition lets you search for words inside images, so nothing gets lost. Productivity goes up when you spend less time searching and more time doing.

Seamless Collaboration

Working together should feel natural, not forced. Simplicity wins again when you use Microsoft Teams, SharePoint, and Copilot to connect with others.

Teams gives you one place for all your documents. No more switching between apps.
You can chat or start a video call right inside Teams. Quick questions get quick answers.
Teams brings in updates from other apps, so everyone stays in the loop.
You can link emails from Outlook to Teams channels. Sharing info is a breeze.

SharePoint’s built-in simplicity helps your team find and share content without hassle. AI-driven search and smart tagging mean everyone can locate what they need, even in a big library of files.

Copilot takes things further. When you use Copilot in a streamlined Microsoft 365 environment, you get:

Full integration with Teams, Outlook, and Word, making your experience smoother.
More time for important work, since Copilot handles repetitive tasks.
Faster onboarding for new team members, so they can contribute right away.
Happier employees who spend less time on boring tasks and more time on creative projects.

When you keep your Microsoft 365 setup simple, you make it easy for everyone to work together. Built-in simplicity means fewer roadblocks and more wins for your team.

Benefits of Simplicity

Stronger Security

You want your data to stay safe. Built-in simplicity in Microsoft 365 helps you protect your organization without making things complicated. When you use integrated device management, you control devices, apps, and data from one place. This makes it easier to spot risks and fix problems fast. With streamlined endpoint security, you get better protection and fewer gaps for threats to sneak in.

You can also take advantage of features like passwordless authentication and single sign-on. These tools make sign-in faster and more secure. You don’t have to remember lots of passwords or worry about weak ones. Your team spends less time dealing with login issues and more time getting work done.

Tip: When you keep your security setup simple, you reduce the chance of mistakes. Fewer steps mean fewer errors.

Easier Management

Managing technology shouldn’t feel like a chore. Built-in simplicity in Microsoft 365 gives your IT team more time to focus on what matters. You can manage updates, devices, and apps from a central console. This approach cuts down on confusion and saves hours each week.

IT specialists have reported that building devices now takes only one hour instead of three.
System updates can be scheduled during nonworking hours, so your business keeps running smoothly.
Help desk tickets drop because users face fewer problems with a simple setup.

A recent survey showed that small and medium businesses saw a 31% drop in time spent on system maintenance after switching to Microsoft 365. IT teams also spent 36% less time managing updates. When you use built-in simplicity, you make life easier for everyone.

Better User Experience

You want tools that just work. Built-in simplicity in Microsoft 365 means you and your team can find what you need quickly. You don’t waste time searching for features or getting lost in menus. Instead, you focus on your work and boost productivity.

When your tools are easy to use, you feel more confident. Teams can collaborate and communicate without barriers. You get faster task completion and higher-quality results. Here’s a quick look at how a simple setup helps:

Benefit	Explanation
Reducing Complexity	You focus on your tasks, not on figuring out extra features.
Enhancing Usability	Intuitive design makes navigation and interaction easy.
Encouraging Adoption	Simple tools make you want to use them more often and more effectively.

You also enjoy better performance and fewer slowdowns. With built-in simplicity, you get a smoother, more satisfying experience every day.

Simple Solutions in Action

Streamlined SharePoint

SharePoint shines when you keep things simple. Many organizations have transformed their daily work by focusing on easy-to-use SharePoint setups. Take a look at how different teams have used SharePoint to boost results:

Organization	Implementation Description
Marketing Teams	Co-create plans across 25 business segments, enabling mobile access for executives and collaboration without version conflicts.
Douglas Elliman	Launched 'Douglas' intranet on SharePoint Online for agents across 113 offices, providing access to tools, data, and a chatbot.
Ardent Mills	Used SharePoint lists as a data layer for custom Power Apps, evolving into a network of tools across 35+ facilities for various tasks.
Toyota	Customized project sites in SharePoint for managing internal projects, enhancing visibility and compliance across departments.
University of Oxford	Implemented a SharePoint-powered self-service portal for IT support, allowing staff and students to log issues and track requests.

Knowledge Management

You want your team to find information fast. SharePoint helps by centralizing documents and data, so everyone knows where to look. When you focus on knowledge management, you break down silos and make collaboration easier. Employees get quick access to what they need, which means better decisions and higher productivity. SharePoint’s security features also keep your sensitive information safe while letting teams work together smoothly.

Centralized repository for easy access to documents and information.
Collaboration tools like document co-authoring and version control.
Integration with other Microsoft tools for a cohesive environment.

Automation

SharePoint isn’t just for storing files. You can automate routine tasks, like approvals or notifications, so your team spends less time on manual work. For example, Ardent Mills used SharePoint lists as a data layer for custom apps, helping teams across dozens of facilities manage their workload more efficiently. Automation in SharePoint means you can focus on what matters most, not on repetitive steps.

Teams Best Practices

Microsoft Teams works best when you keep your setup simple and organized. Here are some best practices that help reduce complexity and improve collaboration:

Use channels for group and project work.
Standardize the meeting experience for scheduling and joining.
Store team content in SharePoint and individual files in OneDrive.
Establish a default approach for task management.

During a Teams meeting, you and your colleagues can collaborate on an Excel spreadsheet in real-time, making updates and calculations as you discuss the data.

You can also set up governance controls to manage large teams, define clear collaboration standards, and integrate Teams with other Microsoft 365 apps. AI agents can help with cross-team knowledge discovery and onboarding, making your workload management smoother.

Copilot Integration

Copilot brings a new level of simplicity to Microsoft 365. Imagine your finance team dropping documents into SharePoint. Copilot automatically extracts data, summarizes insights, and creates polished reports in Word or visualizations in Excel. What once took days now takes hours. You get more time for strategic work and less time on routine tasks.

Copilot offers:

Intelligent document assistance
Productivity recommendations
Data insights and visualization
Natural language processing
Smart meeting assistance

With Copilot, you automate repetitive work, improve collaboration, and keep your data secure. This fits perfectly with integrated device management and streamlined endpoint security, making your Microsoft 365 environment both simple and safe.

Practical Tips for Maintaining Simplicity

Focus on Essentials

Start with what you really need. Microsoft 365 offers a lot, but you don’t have to use every feature. Think about your daily tasks. Which tools help you finish work faster? Which ones do you use most? Stick with those. When you focus on the essentials, you avoid clutter and confusion. Your team will thank you for keeping things clear.

You can make a list of your top tools. For example, maybe you use Teams for meetings, SharePoint for documents, and Outlook for email. That’s your core set. If you add new tools, ask yourself if they solve a real problem. If not, skip them. This approach helps you find the absolute minimum solution that works for your team.

Tip: Review your tools every few months. Remove anything you don’t use. This keeps your workspace clean and easy to manage.

Limit Customizations

It’s tempting to tweak every setting or build custom apps. But too many changes can make things messy. Customizations can break when Microsoft 365 updates. They can also confuse new users. Try to use the default settings as much as possible. Microsoft designs these tools to work well out of the box.

If you need to customize, keep it simple. Change only what helps everyone. For example, you might add your company logo or set up a few custom views in SharePoint. Avoid building complex workflows unless they save a lot of time. Simple setups are easier to support and update.

Here’s a quick checklist to help you decide if a customization is worth it:

Does it solve a common problem for many users?
Will it save time or reduce errors?
Can you support it easily if something breaks?

If you answer “no” to most questions, stick with the basics.

Prioritize User Training

Training makes everything easier. When you know how to use Microsoft 365, you feel more confident and get more done. Many organizations see training as a smart investment. In fact, most companies expect to spend money on training when they roll out new tools like Copilot. New users often spend about 10 hours each year on onboarding. Even outside of formal classes, employees spend around 15 hours a year exploring and testing features on their own.

Here’s a look at how training impacts your team:

What Happens During Training	Why It Matters
Upfront training costs are expected	Shows that training is part of a smart rollout plan
Users spend 10 hours on onboarding	Helps everyone get comfortable with new tools
15 hours spent on self-discovery each year	Shows that people want to learn and use features well

Note: When you invest in training, you help your team avoid mistakes and use Microsoft 365 to its full potential.

Encourage your team to ask questions and share tips. You can set up short training sessions or create a space in Teams for sharing how-to guides. The more your team learns, the simpler their workday becomes.

Effective Governance

You might hear the word “governance” and think it sounds complicated. In Microsoft 365, governance simply means setting clear rules and making sure everyone follows them. When you keep your governance simple, you make life easier for your team and your IT staff.

Let’s break it down. Effective governance helps you avoid chaos. You know who can access what, and you don’t have to worry about mistakes or confusion. You set up permissions so only the right people see sensitive information. This builds trust and keeps your data safe.

Here’s how you can use governance to keep things simple:

Set clear access controls. Decide who can view, edit, or share documents. You don’t need to give everyone access to everything. When you limit permissions, you reduce risks and make management easier.
Create easy-to-follow policies. Write down your rules for using Microsoft 365 tools. Make sure everyone understands them. You can use short guides or quick videos to explain the basics.
Review permissions regularly. Check who has access to your files and apps. Remove access for people who no longer need it. This keeps your environment clean and secure.
Use built-in tools for monitoring. Microsoft 365 offers dashboards and reports. You can see who is using which tools and spot any unusual activity. This helps you catch problems early.

Tip: When you keep your governance simple, you spend less time fixing mistakes and more time focusing on your work.

You might wonder how governance affects your daily routine. It actually makes things smoother. You don’t have to guess where to find documents or worry about sharing the wrong file. Everyone knows the rules, so collaboration feels natural.

Take a look at this quick table to see the benefits of effective governance:

Benefit	How It Helps You
Consistent access	You always know who can see or edit your documents
Streamlined management	IT teams handle fewer problems and save time
Trust in permissions	You feel confident sharing and collaborating

You can start small. Pick one area, like Teams or SharePoint, and set up basic rules. As your team grows, update your policies. Keep things clear and simple. If you ever feel lost, ask your IT team for help or check Microsoft’s online resources.

Remember, governance isn’t about making things harder. It’s about creating a safe, organized space where you and your team can do your best work. When you focus on effective governance, you build a foundation for lasting simplicity in Microsoft 365.

Building a Simplicity Culture

Creating a culture of simplicity in Microsoft 365 starts with you and your team. You can make things easier for everyone by recognizing complexity, encouraging discipline, and communicating clearly. Let’s break down how you can build this culture step by step.

Recognize Complexity

You can’t fix what you don’t see. Start by spotting where things get complicated in your Microsoft 365 environment. Maybe you notice too many unused Teams channels or confusing file names. You might see people struggling with permissions or not knowing which app to use.

Here are some smart practices that help teams recognize and address unnecessary complexity:

Practice	Description
Establish clear policies	Set guidelines for naming, guest access, and content management.
Use least-privilege access	Give users only the access they need to do their jobs.
Leverage automated provisioning	Use templates to create new workspaces that follow your rules.
Monitor inactive resources	Check for unused sites or licenses and clean them up.
Provide governance training	Teach your team about your policies so everyone stays on the same page.

When you follow these steps, you make it easier to spot and remove clutter. You help your team focus on what matters most.

Encourage Discipline

Simplicity doesn’t happen by accident. You need discipline to keep things running smoothly. This means setting standards and sticking to them, even when things get busy.

Define shared standards for using Microsoft 365 tools.
Make sure your daily work stays organized and doesn’t get scattered.
Run Microsoft 365 as one system, not a bunch of separate apps.
Set clear home bases for different types of work.
Write down your standard choices so everyone knows what to expect.

You can also build discipline with these steps:

Try new features and see what works.
Make good habits stick.
Keep exploring for better ways to work.
Pick three Copilot moments for each role.
Reuse solutions instead of reinventing them.
Celebrate time saved, not just clever tricks.
Show off good habits so others can follow.

A routine helps you stay on track. When you set a schedule and check your progress, you keep your team motivated. If something doesn’t work, you can adjust your plan. Consistency is key—even small steps add up over time.

Communicate Clearly

Clear communication keeps everyone moving in the same direction. You want your team to know what’s changing, why it matters, and how it helps them.

Strategy	Description
Leadership Communication	Leaders should explain why change is needed to get everyone on board.
Direct Communication	Managers should talk about changes that affect their teams.
User-Centric Messaging	Always answer, “What’s in it for me?” to keep people interested.
Diverse Communication Channels	Use emails, events, and even games to make learning fun and engaging.
Helpdesk Support	Make sure your helpdesk is ready to answer questions and solve problems.
Champion Engagement	Get power users involved to support and inspire others.

When you use these strategies, you build trust and excitement. Your team feels supported and ready to embrace simplicity in Microsoft 365.

Real-World Success Stories

Teams Rollout

You might wonder how other organizations make Microsoft Teams work so well. The answer often comes down to keeping things simple. Many companies focus on easy videoconferencing and collaboration tools. This approach helps everyone communicate better, both inside and outside the company.

BDP, a global design practice, used Teams to manage office attendance and desk booking. They kept their setup streamlined, so employees could check in and reserve spaces without confusion.
One company with offices around the world worked with New Era to roll out Teams Rooms. They wanted a simple, consistent experience in every location. This made support and management much easier for their IT teams.

When you focus on simplicity, you help your team adopt new tools faster. You also make it easier for everyone to stay connected and productive.

SharePoint Migration

Moving to SharePoint can feel like a big step, but you can make it smooth by focusing on what matters most. Many organizations have found that a simple migration brings big benefits.

You reduce operational overhead and lower compliance risk.
Permission management becomes easier, so you spend less time on admin tasks.
Role-based training helps everyone get comfortable quickly, which boosts adoption rates.
Standardizing collaboration makes cross-team work simple and secure.
SharePoint gives you a central place for data, so you spend less time searching for information.
Non-technical teams can build their own tools, which means more independence and faster results.
You can create custom forms, track data, and use mobile apps without extra hassle.
Integration with Power BI and AI features gives you better insights and smarter analytics.
SharePoint works well for knowledge management, centralizing information and keeping it secure.
Teams across different locations can collaborate easily, thanks to seamless integration with other Microsoft tools.

When you keep your SharePoint migration simple, you set your team up for success. Everyone knows where to find what they need, and you can scale as your business grows.

Workflow Simplification

You want your daily work to run smoothly. Simplifying workflows in Microsoft 365 can make a huge difference. Many businesses have seen big improvements after streamlining their processes.

Improvement Type	Description
Productivity Gains	Some businesses report up to 66% productivity gains after implementing Microsoft 365 workflows.
Error Reduction	Automation eliminates manual repetitive tasks and reduces human errors across organizations.
Time Savings	Automation leads to faster turnaround times and measurable ROI when properly governed.

When you automate routine steps, you save time and cut down on mistakes. You also free up your team to focus on more important work, like task management and creative problem-solving. With the right setup, task management becomes easier for everyone, and you see results faster.

Simplicity wins every time in Microsoft 365. You see better productivity, stronger security, and happier users when you keep things clear and easy. Focus on user-centric design, training, and good governance. Take a look at your own setup and find ways to simplify. Simplicity wins when you keep learning and adapting. Stay curious and support your team for lasting success.

FAQ

What does “keeping it simple” mean in Microsoft 365?

You focus on the tools and features you use most. You avoid extra steps, customizations, or apps that add confusion. Simple setups help you work faster and make it easier for everyone to learn.

How can I avoid tool fatigue in Microsoft 365?

Stick to your core apps, like Teams, SharePoint, and Outlook. Review your tools every few months. Remove anything you don’t use.

Tip: Less is more. Fewer tools mean less stress.

Is it safe to use default settings in Microsoft 365?

Yes! Microsoft designs default settings for security and ease of use. You get strong protection and a smooth experience. If you need changes, keep them simple and only adjust what helps everyone.

How does user training help with simplicity?

Training helps you and your team learn the best ways to use Microsoft 365. You avoid mistakes and save time.

You feel more confident.
You get more done.
You help others learn, too.

What is governance in Microsoft 365?

Governance means setting clear rules for how you use Microsoft 365. You decide who can see, edit, or share files. Good governance keeps your data safe and your team organized.

Can I automate tasks without making things complicated?

Absolutely! Use built-in tools like Power Automate for simple workflows. Start small. Automate tasks you do often, like approvals or reminders.

Note: Simple automations save time and reduce errors.

How do I know if I’m over-customizing?

Ask yourself:

Does this change help everyone?
Will it be easy to support?
Does it solve a real problem? If you answer “no” to most, keep things basic.

What should I do if my team resists new tools?

Start with clear communication. Show how the new tool makes work easier. Offer short training sessions.

Encourage questions and celebrate small wins together.

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Hello everyone and welcome to a medallion of the M365 podcast.

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Today we're talking about Microsoft 365, co-pilot user adaption, digital cars and vice

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simply city matters more than ever.

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So my today guest is Microsoft MVP, co-pilot specialist and self-descript and business

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to part all the people of I pronounce something wrong, the nook and the babans in the cloud.

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Yeah, if we correct me, I'll pronounce it right and yeah, how did you end up in the Microsoft

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world?

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Let's start with the pronouncing.

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It's the nook and the babans in the cloud.

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Do you know what it means?

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No.

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No, I'm not.

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My band is it's a pound of the Netherlands.

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Yeah, I'm going from the south part of the Netherlands and I think if I ask my grandmother

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about what people live in the south, you will say we are just farmers from the farmland

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and we have a special pronunciation.

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I don't know if I pronounce that right but and it's very recognizable if you talk to people

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from the north or people from the middle of the Netherlands, they will immediately know

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that you are from the brabond and I'm very proud of that.

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So that's the reason why I'm the brabond in the cloud.

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Awesome.

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And yeah, you are really really new MVP.

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Can you little talk or tell us about your journey from how did you come to the IT topic

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and how you get MVP and also I think in the Netherlands has a secret organization that

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helps people to get MVP.

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It's the Dutch woman in tech.

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Oh, well, I don't think that's completely, I don't know if that's right but I will start

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on my journey and then explain something about Dutch woman in tech.

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Just start with my journey.

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Well, I sat in the introduction when we talked before this podcast that it was a very special

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day for me when I became an MVP, not only becoming an MVP is very, very nice, very, like a celebration

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of all your hard work, but it was also a very special day because I was working in IT for exactly

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five years.

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So in a little bit more about my journey, I did not study to work in IT as a lot of people.

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I studied leisure management so to organize big festivals, dance events and stuff like that.

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And the component that is the same as in IT is that there are a lot of people involving

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and everything is happening at a very speed, it is in a lot of things change in a short amount

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of time.

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That's also happening on festivals.

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So that's the common thing, the dance events and the IT sector have in common.

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But five years ago I made the decision when I met someone at the coffee machine to jump

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into the world of IT and start as a user adoption consultant, so more about explaining how to

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work with the tools.

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And at that time I worked at a very technical company.

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So to talk with my colleagues, I had to learn more about the technical admin side of Microsoft

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365.

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So I did that for five years and now I'm here.

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And that way.

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Yeah.

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Can you tell us a little bit more about the secret organization that make all these MVPs?

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Well, I don't think it's an organization to make MVPs that sounds a little bit strange

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in my opinion.

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But it's about the work you put into the organization that's in the human attack.

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What we do there is put women in the visibility in the IT world.

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And we all play a big part in my opinion in the Microsoft world all on different aspects.

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So it's not a secret organization that makes you MVP.

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It's a recognition for all the hard work we all are doing as part of the human attack.

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Yeah.

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And it's great because I have talked to a lot of women, especially from the Netherlands.

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And they're doing so a great job to make this visibility.

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And this is one of the biggest part to become an MVP, I think.

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So let us dive a little bit into the Microsoft 365 world.

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A lot of people see Microsoft 365 as just tools.

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You clearly see more than that and why?

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Well, in the end, it are tools to do your job.

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That's how I describe it in one sentence.

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But to use that tools, it's very complex.

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I think that if I ask people, for example, if I ask my friends or my family, what are you

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using of the Microsoft 365 suite?

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It are just the famous words, Excel and PowerPoint.

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But it's much more than that.

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And I think that there are so many tools that are part of the Microsoft suite that you need

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guidance to use them right.

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How they connect to each other, how you can use them to do your job more efficiency, more

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productive.

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So there are, in my opinion, it's a lot.

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So you need some guidance to use them right.

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Have you a favorite tool?

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Yeah, but there's not really a tool.

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I call it the engine of the Microsoft 365 suite.

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And I know, I know for all the technical people, that's not completely right.

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So my apologize for that, but my favorite tool is SharePoint.

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And that's kind of a strange tool, but because it's not really a tool.

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But I like that you can be so creative, which are points.

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For example, I use a lot of SharePoints lists to build things in the power platform to be

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the front end of everything I design in the power platform list or document libraries

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that have, that have a last modified date that sending messages to people to update those

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documents.

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So I use SharePoint as my front end for everything I like to develop in Power Apps or Power Platform.

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Yeah, and it's such a modern, such a, yeah, important part because it's connected to all to one

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drive, two teams.

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And I think it's the, yeah, we can say the brain or the brain of modern work.

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What fascinating you, you most about modern work or modern work places?

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Well, that's a good question.

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I think what is the, well, it fascinates me.

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I don't know if fascinates is the right words to describe it, but what I see happening

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around me is that everything in Microsoft 365 is changing so fast and you can work all

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day and read all those blogs and things on the roadmap and still think at the end of

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the day, I don't know.

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Everything that has changed in a couple last 24 hours.

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So it fascinates me that everything is changing so fast and I'm wondering myself, how can

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we help users, but also at things or IT persons or the decision makers to know everything

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they need to know, to make the right decisions because it's happening also fast in a short amount

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of time.

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And I, my main part of my job is know everything that's changed in Microsoft 365 and I'm not

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able to know everything.

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So how could those other people know that?

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Yeah, you have a blog, the EV point and L and yeah, I'm mind that it's very bad.

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I was, my young, young, I was really often there, but yeah, but I have translate a little

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bit and I'll make an overlook and write about stress, chaos, overload and simplicity.

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Why is that such a topic for you?

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So I found it important that I, well, I always say to people, if you cannot explain it easy,

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you don't understand it completely.

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And that's also when I say that a lot of engineers at our company or the company you used to

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work for are laughing at me and saying, well, some technical things you cannot explain easily,

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you're not able to because they are so complex, but I'm, I'm believing that you can, that you

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can make those complex things easy by just providing practical examples by just taking

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people step by step in what options they have and what is the outcome for the end user.

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When you pick a certain option as an admin or as a decision maker, what will be the result

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on the, on the daily job people are working in.

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Cool.

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So then I make a stress test.

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So I don't understand when I should use banner and to do, can you explain me this in

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simple words?

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Use for yourself, planar is for a group.

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Okay.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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This was really simple.

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It's like, when we got all this new technology, actually, we got co-pilot, what the biggest

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mistake organizations make when they introducing the new technology we got?

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Well, that's a, I think that's some, that is something we all recognize as people that

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are working in the co-pilot field that is, they just purchase a license.

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They're going to explain to the organization, you can use co-pilot now.

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This is how you do it.

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Just one time.

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And then they just let it all go freely and they are imagining that people can, they are

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imagining to keep it practical like, okay, everyone is using chat GPT at home.

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So they know how to work with co-pilot, they know how to work with agents.

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And I think that's false.

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If you use in the admin center, the usage report for the adoption report, you see in this

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cases that when organization implement the license of co-pilot, they are telling how

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to use co-pilot, you see a big, many people in the organization are using co-pilot and

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then it goes down because it's an habit of those people to use co-pilot.

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So they go back to their normal day to day job and just creating emails, my hands or creating

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PowerPoint presentation by hand because they always don't have that way.

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And the success of co-pilot is creating a habit for the people that needs to work with co-pilot.

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They have to keep in mind of how to use co-pilot, how to interact with co-pilot, to give them

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different angles on where they can use co-pilot for.

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And when you do that, you create a new habit for those people and then is, then I think co-pilot

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will be a success in your organization or specific team because I'm also a believer that

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not all people in the organization can use co-pilot in their day to day job because for

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example, if you work in finance, you can work in another system most of the time and then

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co-pilot can help you in that specific system.

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Yeah, awesome.

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I'm sorry, though, I was kicked out of the internet.

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I see, I see problems.

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We also have someone, but they have all this license.

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But the people don't use it, I think, in an effectively way or they don't understand

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what do their companies wrong or what do the people wrong?

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Yeah, as I mentioned before, they are thinking that they can just give one workshop or one

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explanation and everything knows how it, everyone knows how it works.

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That's not true.

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A lot of people in this world are using chat GPT or co-pilot or I don't know what they are

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using on all these different AIs that are available, but they use it at home for easy

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things like riding a birthday card or finding a recipe with all the ingredients they have

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in the refrigerator or it are easy things.

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For example, hey, co-pilot, can you write the stacks for me in a good, more fluent way or

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can you write the stacks for me in a bra band way to keep them, but they are not using it

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for, let's call it business cases.

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I think it's completely different using an AIs solution at home than how you need to use

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it in such a business.

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And you need to help people with that to give them a lot of tips how they can use it in

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those business cases.

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You can create agents as an IT person in a company, specific agents that are built for your

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business, so you help people with more business specific information or business specific

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use cases and they are more likely to adopt it as a habit because it's more useful in

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their role that have in the company.

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Did you think Microsoft sometimes overcomplicates its own ecosystem?

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Well, I think that's true because what I always say to my friends is if Microsoft make their

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ecosystem a very easy, there was no job for me because everyone knows how they need to

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work with the tools and also how to need an admin's knows how to configure everything

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in the background.

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So to be honest with that, yes, I think that sometimes it's a complex, they created a complex

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ecosystem in the front end with also in the back end, but I don't know how they could make

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it easier because there are so many use cases, many options you need to or situations you

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need to use those tools and they also create an ecosystem with a lot of different sectors

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in businesses can use.

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So I think in the end that makes the ecosystem very complex.

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Yesterday I learned something new that when you use Word and you have this copy paste,

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the format, when you double click it, you can use it on all things.

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There's also something I was, yeah, this game changing small thing and I read a little

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bit in your content and you often focus on these small features that make a huge difference.

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Why is it so important for you in this topic?

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I think that if you make, like if you change those small things by a setting or for example,

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by using some different technique, it can create, it can save you a lot of time and it also

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make working in Microsoft 365 more fun, more efficient.

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And I think that's the main focus of my blogs to make it, to make your work easier, not

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only on how you, how you using those tools, but also by putting in some simple settings,

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using some simple techniques and make your work at the end of the work day.

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If you count all those minutes or seconds, you are saving with those easy steps.

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You can implement in a couple of seconds or by using a different way to achieve something.

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If you count all those time you saved at the end of the work day, I think you will save

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a lot of time.

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Every small thing in the end will make a big impact.

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Is the simplicity harder to achieve than enterprise IT than complexity?

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Do you repeat the question?

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What is it?

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For enterprise IT, we can all this do this awesome stuff and build, I don't know, we have,

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I don't know, alone in Azure, we have 1100 services and we can build, I think, nearly

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all what we dream of, but it's to achieve this complexity harder or it's harder to achieve

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simplicity for.

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I think it's the last one, as I said before.

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Also a thing that I used to say a lot and make me not very popular in this world is

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everything you can be broken.

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If you look at the front end of Microsoft 365, for example, SharePoints, you can also

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build a lot of things by custom web art, stuff like that.

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I'm not a big fan of that.

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I like building, I like knitzle, crafting, in Dutch, but I think you make it very complex

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when you craft things and craft this between quotes.

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I'm more a fan of easy implementing, I don't know if that's the right translation, but

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using the things that are in place and by putting them in a right for or in a right structure,

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I'm more a fan of that than crafting and building custom things because as I said before, they

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can, they can break.

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But to go back to your question, I think it's hard to, in this complex ecosystem, to reach

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simplicity because if I look from the admin side of Microsoft 365, I think I assume that

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we all like crafting in the Microsoft 365 suite.

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It can be with SharePoint, it can be with Azure, it can be with everything between us, but

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it's harder to keep those craft things just for ourselves and not for the organization

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and focus more on how we can make it easy, how we can use standard tools to achieve the

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same answer for the end user by using the default Microsoft is provide.

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I think that's the hardest part for us as a Microsoft 365 admin.

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Yeah, you have also given a nice talk at the MC65 show about what this will be in admin.

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From your perspective as admin, what do simple Microsoft environments actually look like for

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you?

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Well, I cannot like put an architik, I cannot give you an answer based on how you, well,

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I can assume in all my favorite tools, SharePoint for example, I think from the past, if you

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look back on when we all were working on false shares, we were using groups to handle the

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rights in order permissions in on those folders.

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And when we move to a cloud, we keep to that approach.

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We are still handling or a lot of organizations are still handling permission based on groups

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because we all want role-based access or anything, but if you look from the Microsoft perspective,

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an easy environment is more based on using the default Microsoft 365 groups and pointing

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out owners that are responsible for who kind of access those groups.

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And in my opinion, they're still a big gap on what we do because we did it in the past as

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a Microsoft 365 admin.

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For example, using this security groups to handle permissions in SharePoint and what

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Microsoft best practices using Microsoft 365 groups.

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And the reason why they're still a big gap in my opinion is that if you go to the more,

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let's say, Microsoft approach by pointing out owners in Microsoft 365 groups that are responsible

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for the access, you need to provide this owners with training, workshops, communication

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and everything that has to do more with how you work than how you configure it in the back

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end.

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So is it more simplicity or make it simple?

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It's more a change management topic or is it technical topic?

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I think it's both of them, but in my opinion, change management and communication and providing

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people with the right context to do what they need to do in the Microsoft 365 environment

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is what is very complex and will be very complex and will always be very complex in the future,

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but it's also very important because in my opinion, the complexity of IT is going from configuring

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in the backgrounds more to explaining people how to use the tool safely, what they can do

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to use the tool safety.

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So it's more going from the IT technical admin to change management, adoption, perspective

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and stuff like that.

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Awesome.

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And what creates these digital cars today, especially when we think, I think it's a governance

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topic or is it a compliance topic or is it a tool topic?

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What did you think?

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That's a good question.

269
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:16,000
Let me think on that.

270
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:24,240
Well, you mean, is it more focused on what aspect or?

271
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:33,520
I think, why did these cars, where did it come from?

272
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:41,240
Is it why we're not as IT, for my IT side, we're not managed enough or the leadership

273
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:49,200
we've not clear instructions or the people are, I don't know, there are totally crazy.

274
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:59,520
I take the complexity is it came from different, well, it's created by different points in,

275
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:06,680
it's created by the complex complexity or the Microsoft platform and every new developments

276
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:08,280
they are doing.

277
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:19,840
It's also because it must be easier with the use of tools to handle all those technical

278
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:21,160
configurations.

279
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:26,320
And so the focus is more going from the technical perspective to having the conversation

280
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:28,960
with your customer about compliance.

281
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:35,320
About how they want to work, about the way of working, but also security wise, how they

282
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:42,400
want to inform their organization on everything that is happening in this world.

283
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:50,320
So I think it's the answer on that question is the focus shift from technical decisions

284
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:56,160
to more organization decisions on all those different approaches.

285
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,240
Awesome.

286
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:06,480
I think a little bit about AI, do this create more complexity or makes it more simpler.

287
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,440
What's your perspective?

288
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,960
I think it depends on the mood and the time you're asking me if I'm working in the back

289
00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:23,880
end of Microsoft 365, so configure things, it is getting harder because everything that's

290
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:30,600
new in the Microsoft 365 environment, for example, the use of agents.

291
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:37,960
In the beginning, it's very complex to put settings in the back end in the admin portals

292
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:39,520
because they were not there.

293
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:46,560
So you need to use, for example, PowerShell or Graph to work around the buttons that are

294
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:52,040
not there to achieve what you want to achieve.

295
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:59,360
So if I'm working on the admin centers of Microsoft 365, I think I would say that it makes

296
00:27:59,360 --> 00:28:02,440
my job or my day harder.

297
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:11,080
But if you ask me on a different moment and I'm working with the agents I built in co-pilot

298
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:19,600
that I'm using on very easy scenarios, for example, I'm very bad at languages, so writing

299
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:25,040
down, writing in Dutch, but also in English, has always been hard for me.

300
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:30,880
So I build an agent that I call easy language.

301
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:39,920
And when I need to send an email to a customer or send an email to a colleague, I, well, to

302
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,760
start with, I build the agents with co-pilot studio and I give them directions.

303
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:45,240
This is how you need to answer.

304
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:49,000
This is the tone of voice you need to use.

305
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:54,880
And when I want to send a customer an email or a colleague an email, I just put in the message

306
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:59,240
I want to deliver to them and the agent is creating an email.

307
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:06,840
And in the last couple of days, with all the new development, Microsoft has rolled out,

308
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,240
it can also put the email in a draft in my inbox.

309
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:16,960
I just need to read it once and just press send.

310
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:21,040
So it makes my job very easy in that case.

311
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:22,040
Okay.

312
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,040
So we can say 50/50.

313
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:30,320
It depends on the mood, the time, the day, and the case I'm working on.

314
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,400
How much cover we had?

315
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:42,200
When we think about co-pilot, is it exposing organizational problems more than creating

316
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:43,600
new one?

317
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:48,200
Yeah, I think that's a good assumption that you're making.

318
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:54,320
Well, I think two years ago, I had a lot of discussions with the clients I had back then

319
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:59,760
about you need to think of functional governance was the term I was using.

320
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:07,880
So how you are creating SharePoint sites or teams, what is the template you are using, how

321
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:11,760
you're going to archive your data.

322
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:16,160
You're going to throw it away or you put it in blob storage or what's the way, you're going

323
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:22,000
to handle your life cycle of the data, but also how you manage ingest users.

324
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:27,640
That were all topics I was scaling under functional governance.

325
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:33,280
And it was a very hard discussion to have because people or organization were saying, I'm

326
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,760
not going to put time in that.

327
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:43,960
If my environment is safe and data is not going out of the organization and not leaving in

328
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,800
real directions, I'm fine with it.

329
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:53,840
But now a couple of years later, if you don't have permissions or you have a lot of old data,

330
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:56,920
co-pilot will put it up and use it in their answer.

331
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,520
So it will become a problem.

332
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:07,280
And also a problem that not only co-pilot wise, but that a lot of organization facing is

333
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,480
SharePoint storage.

334
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:15,600
It's costing a lot of money and a couple of years ago I was saying, organizations, you need

335
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:21,200
to think of how you handle your storage, how you're going to archive your data, what you're

336
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:24,040
going to delete.

337
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,600
And it was a hard conversation to have back then.

338
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:32,240
But now they need to pay money for the additional storage and they are very willing of being

339
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,040
part of this conversation.

340
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:35,040
Yeah.

341
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:39,520
Sometimes it's paying for something good.

342
00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:41,920
Yeah, I like it.

343
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:50,320
I have read out your blog and you say there, AA, actually like a mirror for organizations.

344
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:53,240
Can you explain what you mean with this?

345
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:54,240
Yeah.

346
00:31:54,240 --> 00:32:02,880
I think it's a little bit of my example I put out before.

347
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:04,160
It was always there.

348
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:10,160
The permissions that were wrong, the overcrowded of data, the not having an archival policy,

349
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,160
it was all there, but it was not feasible.

350
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:20,120
Only when you are searching in the Microsoft 365 search and let's be honest, a lot of people

351
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:27,280
are still working from their finder or their explorer.

352
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:33,680
So they were not having those issues by using the search that all data were coming up.

353
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:40,440
But now all those organizations are going to use co-pilot and co-pilot will use that all

354
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:45,720
document from 10 years ago, still in his answers and the data is not correct.

355
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:52,560
So it's really a mirror for organizations to see what data they have, what data is still

356
00:32:52,560 --> 00:33:01,120
valuable for their organization, and what data is they're getting dust and shoot or be deleted

357
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:07,480
or put into cold storage because it needs to be saved for example the governance or stuff

358
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,000
like that.

359
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:18,120
We have a little bit bus words I call it, I readiness or co-pilot readiness.

360
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:21,880
We read a lot of times on LinkedIn.

361
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:26,280
What makes the company ready for the age of AI?

362
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:34,880
Well I think all the companies have to be ready because it's there.

363
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:42,960
There's no way of being not ready for AI because I'm sitting with a lot of companies at the

364
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:47,600
table and they are saying okay we're not ready for AI, we're not going to use it in our

365
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:53,080
company and I can assume that a lot of people that are working in that company are using

366
00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:54,080
AI.

367
00:33:54,080 --> 00:34:00,040
If it's not their co-pilot, free license, it's their chat GPT personal account that they

368
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:03,400
are paying for my home.

369
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:10,760
So I think that a lot of companies, if you look at it from a functional side, they are

370
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:15,880
not ready for AI because they have a lot of old data and our permissions are not fully

371
00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:26,480
inside or they have a lot of all those things that we classify as co-pilot ready with organizations

372
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,320
they have to be ready because it's there.

373
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:36,360
No, as I also said in the MicroStri 365 podcast, you can start small introducing in your

374
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:41,560
company that you're going to work with at AI, provide all the people from the company

375
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:47,360
with the tools and the knowledge they need to have to work with on a safe way, work with

376
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:48,360
co-pilot.

377
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:53,240
For example, tell the people in your company, you're not getting a co-pilot license because

378
00:34:53,240 --> 00:34:59,080
we are having a small group of people that are starting in our company with a paid version

379
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:07,480
of co-pilot, but here you can use the free co-pilot app, it's safe if you are locked in and

380
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,840
this is the way you can use it also with your company data.

381
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:18,200
So I think it's not being ready, it's more you need to be ready and this is the way how

382
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:24,000
and give the people the tools how they can use it safe.

383
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:35,680
And when we think about governance, will you say when the company have done it in the

384
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:42,360
cloud, age, all right, then there's no problem to adapt co-pilot or if there are something

385
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:44,080
what changed?

386
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:52,960
Well, I think a lot of people or organizations are talking about governance a lot, but they

387
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:59,040
might be, and there are two different governance in the Microsoft 365 environment.

388
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:05,240
You have the governance that is based on how you can enter your Microsoft 365 environment

389
00:36:05,240 --> 00:36:11,280
on what devices, on what conditions, so more the technical governance, how introduce

390
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:16,160
configured, how conditional access is configured, and that is governance.

391
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:24,800
A lot of companies are talking and thinking a already a long time on that specific technical

392
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:25,800
governance.

393
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:32,360
I think it's more shifting to functional governance and that's a topic we and a lot of companies

394
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:39,400
need to think more about and talk more about and I think that's more in the way of being

395
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:42,120
co-pilot ready.

396
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:50,600
What's the top tip to make a company co-pilot ready?

397
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:55,120
So it are more on the easy things you can put in place.

398
00:36:55,120 --> 00:37:01,760
For example, you can create a template document library, so templates are available in

399
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:08,720
worth Excel and PowerPoint, and because you do so, co-pilot will recognize those as templates

400
00:37:08,720 --> 00:37:15,920
as you can use them in prompts and co-pilot can use them if they are configured correctly

401
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:18,000
by creating, for example, presentations.

402
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:24,720
So it's more on those functional steps or functional settings you as an admin can provide

403
00:37:24,720 --> 00:37:28,520
to get more out of co-pilot.

404
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:30,400
So that's the first tip.

405
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:42,800
This is good, Microsoft Teams come out and all people hate it.

406
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,560
I think the most people hate it.

407
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:54,040
Now it's the center of work, I say, in many organizations for me, it's definitely right

408
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:56,000
off of LinkedIn.

409
00:37:56,000 --> 00:38:03,600
Did you think this is a good, this good, it's more evil to use co-pilot.

410
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:04,600
Yeah.

411
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:06,520
Yeah, tips sort.

412
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:13,520
I think that's, I think it depends on the company you're working for, because you can see

413
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:17,840
teams as an additional communication platform.

414
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:23,160
And in that scenario, I think it's really a distraction for the people that are working

415
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:24,480
there.

416
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:30,080
I see a lot of companies that are using teams for their internal communication and use

417
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:37,120
their email and they have a tool, for example, a false that is also provided by HR and is also

418
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:38,960
providing news.

419
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:45,000
And if you have all those different tools and what's set is also a very or telegram.

420
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:50,040
And if you have all those tools and clays, I think it's a lot of overload for internal

421
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:52,080
communication.

422
00:38:52,080 --> 00:39:01,080
And if you listen to this podcast and you recognize your company in this scenario, please go back

423
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:08,080
to the drawing table and think of what communication platforms you really need.

424
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:13,680
And if you're using, for example, only teams and maybe a SharePoint communication site that

425
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:19,880
you can also put in teams by using the, I was saying FIVA connection, but that's not the

426
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:21,880
right name anymore.

427
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:28,880
But if you are seeing, for example, only teams for internal communication, the post to chats

428
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:37,360
and also a SharePoint site for the more newsletter, newsletter kind of communication, I think

429
00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:43,280
is a really nice platform and a really good way of starting, but also being a part of your

430
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:44,280
day.

431
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:51,800
I have a blog and your post and there's something you really often write about.

432
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:54,720
It's about the topic metadag.

433
00:39:54,720 --> 00:39:55,720
Yeah.

434
00:39:55,720 --> 00:39:56,720
Yeah.

435
00:39:56,720 --> 00:39:57,720
It is.

436
00:39:57,720 --> 00:40:01,720
Yeah, you are a little bit passionate about the topic.

437
00:40:01,720 --> 00:40:06,440
So can you like what, what are metadag.

438
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:11,440
And why they are so, yeah, so important for you.

439
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:12,440
Yeah.

440
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:18,240
In the ideal situation or the only good answer to give you here is that you don't need followers

441
00:40:18,240 --> 00:40:25,180
and just use metadata because it's very easy in a search engine of Microsoft 365 and

442
00:40:25,180 --> 00:40:27,880
also work with different views.

443
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:34,480
But we all know that companies, including myself, are not working in the ideal world.

444
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:37,640
So we're all using folders.

445
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:43,480
But with my blogs about metadata, I hope I can give you an insight or how you can use

446
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:46,640
metadata in your advantage.

447
00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:55,440
For example, yesterday I wrote a blog about creating a knowledge space by using one document

448
00:40:55,440 --> 00:41:00,360
library and call it knowledge place or give it a funny name.

449
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:06,560
And you put all those documents in it and provide in a drop down what kind of rule in

450
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:10,080
your organization, the document is relevant.

451
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,560
You can create those different views on the different rules that you're having a company.

452
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:21,600
And people can just go to the knowledge space, press for example service manager or engineer.

453
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:26,440
I only see the documents that are relevant for their kind of job.

454
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:30,560
They need to do or things they need to do inside the company.

455
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:37,920
And I think it's a big win because you have one place where all your knowledge is in.

456
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:44,160
But people can use those buttons or those views only to look at documents or information

457
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:45,920
that is relevant for them.

458
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:49,720
So you're not overflowing them with communication or documents.

459
00:41:49,720 --> 00:41:53,440
They need to go through to find a relevant one.

460
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:58,640
So to answer your question, I'm asking about metadata.

461
00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:01,760
Because you can do a lot with it and I like crafting.

462
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:07,480
As I mentioned in the start of our conversation and this is the way to craft in SharePoints.

463
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:11,120
This is awesome.

464
00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:24,080
I think it's, we are hopefully we are joining a time where we're removing from traditional

465
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:26,320
file structure.

466
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:29,240
I think that makes sense.

467
00:42:29,240 --> 00:42:40,800
I know it because I have all these folders and yeah, I renamed it in the form nothing.

468
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:51,080
When you have the chance to say Microsoft, one thing they should publish tomorrow.

469
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:52,560
What thing is it?

470
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:57,960
That's a good one.

471
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:05,040
It sounds wrong to say because I practice and preach all about SharePoints are using Teams.

472
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:13,600
But I think that the new Outlook app, a lot of they have to publish more feature into that

473
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:23,360
into the new Outlook app or more working features and it is about making it easier to work

474
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:25,360
with multiple accounts.

475
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:30,120
We are living in a world that people have multiple accounts.

476
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:36,440
For example, they are a volunteer, they are working for a company, they have an account for

477
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:38,440
themselves.

478
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:43,800
Microsoft has taken a lot of steps into working with more accounts.

479
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:52,040
For example, it's much easier to change accounts when you have a Teams meeting or need to change

480
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:54,160
in the Teams app.

481
00:43:54,160 --> 00:44:01,660
I think they need to put that in place in more applications they have because it's still

482
00:44:01,660 --> 00:44:07,360
very hard to work with multiple accounts and switching is easier than it was two years

483
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:11,880
ago but still quite hard to do so.

484
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:14,640
So now we can join the rapid fire round.

485
00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:19,040
I asked questions and you give a short answer.

486
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:20,040
Okay.

487
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:22,600
Teams from Outlook.

488
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:23,600
Teams.

489
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:24,600
Okay.

490
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:26,720
A loop on one node.

491
00:44:26,720 --> 00:44:27,720
One node.

492
00:44:27,720 --> 00:44:29,720
Zinc or short cuts.

493
00:44:29,720 --> 00:44:34,320
Oh, that's a hard one.

494
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:37,520
Let's call sync.

495
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:38,520
Okay.

496
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:41,320
Three kinds of little bit of ball.

497
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:45,160
It's a baller.

498
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:48,400
Structure or flexibility?

499
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:49,400
Flexibility.

500
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:50,400
Oh yeah.

501
00:44:50,400 --> 00:44:55,200
This is the last one.

502
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:56,200
Flexibility.

503
00:44:56,200 --> 00:45:01,600
Is assistant or human assistant?

504
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:03,760
I think human assistant.

505
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:05,960
Favorite Microsoft app?

506
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:06,960
SharePoint.

507
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:08,800
Oh, blah, blah, blah.

508
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:09,800
Sorry?

509
00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:13,800
Shukovla, blah, blah, blah.

510
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:14,800
Yeah.

511
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:21,400
A lot of thank you.

512
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:35,520
So my last question is, what one thing organization should stop doing immediately?

513
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:43,400
Well, I think that's clear for all the listeners that what I'm going to say, but stop looking

514
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:45,120
from the technical side.

515
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:51,480
Look, start looking from the end user perspective or the functional side because to be honest,

516
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:56,200
we as IT persons all do that wrong.

517
00:45:56,200 --> 00:46:00,720
And yeah, the last thing is where can the user find you the listener?

518
00:46:00,720 --> 00:46:04,320
Where can they find your LinkedIn and above?

519
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:05,320
Yeah, no.

520
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:06,720
Just look at my LinkedIn.

521
00:46:06,720 --> 00:46:11,600
I'm sharing a lot of information there also about my blog, AVPoint.

522
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:16,080
That's also based on SharePoint, AVPoint, but that's a funny joke.

523
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:18,040
That's more an internal joke.

524
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:22,640
But just look at me up on LinkedIn, AV from the Velder, a very Dutch name.

525
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:26,600
So I think you put it in the notes or something.

526
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:28,600
But please get in contact.

527
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:33,760
Also if you need some more information about working in Microsoft 365 or anything you want

528
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:35,760
to know, you can ask me anything.

529
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:36,760
Oh, thank you.

530
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:41,000
This was a really funny and cool session.

531
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,560
Thank you so much for your time.

532
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:45,120
And yeah, bye bye.

533
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:46,120
Bye bye.

534
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:46,960
See you next time.

535
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:56,960
[MUSIC]

Mirko Peters

Founder of m365.fm, m365.show and m365con.net

Mirko Peters is a Microsoft 365 expert, content creator, and founder of m365.fm, a platform dedicated to sharing practical insights on modern workplace technologies. His work focuses on Microsoft 365 governance, security, collaboration, and real-world implementation strategies.

Through his podcast and written content, Mirko provides hands-on guidance for IT professionals, architects, and business leaders navigating the complexities of Microsoft 365. He is known for translating complex topics into clear, actionable advice, often highlighting common mistakes and overlooked risks in real-world environments.

With a strong emphasis on community contribution and knowledge sharing, Mirko is actively building a platform that connects experts, shares experiences, and helps organizations get the most out of their Microsoft 365 investments.

Evi van der Velden

👋🏼 Hi, I’m Evi — your go-to person for turning Microsoft 365 chaos into smart, effective solutions. With a versatile background and a passion for variety, I help organizations translate ideas and challenges into meaningful results. From governance and adoption to technical implementation, I love bringing everything together in a way that simply works.

I thrive on collaboration, solving complex problems, and making technology easier and more enjoyable to use. The combination of strategy and hands-on execution is exactly what makes this work so exciting to me.

My personal goal? Sharing more knowledge with the community through speaking sessions, blogs, and inspiring conversations. 💬📝

Why Simplicity Wins in Microsoft 365 with Evi van der Velden [MVP]