From Project Online to AI-Powered Project Delivery: The Evolution of Dynamics 365 Project Operations with Joe Griffin [MVP]

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>> Yeah, welcome to another edition of the M665 podcast.

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Today's guest is someone who combines deep technical expertise with business leadership

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and also a famous singer.

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Joe Griffin is a sheet of Pro-MXUK and Microsoft inner circle partner and one of the most respected

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voices in the Microsoft Business Application community.

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Joe holds more than 40 certifications across dynamics, power platform, Azure, AI and the

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wider Microsoft Cloud.

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He has also become a Microsoft MVP since 2002 and regular share his knowledge at conferences,

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user groups around the world.

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His special area is Dynamics 365 project operations, particular technical implementation,

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solution architect and Azure integrations.

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Today we will explore the Challenging and Organizations faced with moving from project online,

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how modern project management is evolving and where AI fits into the future of project delivery.

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Yo, so I say, welcome to the show.

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>> Welcome, wow, what an intro.

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That's really great. Thank you so much.

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Have you ever been following me all the time to introduce me?

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That's great.

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>> Yeah. For listeners who may not know your background, can you tell us about your journey into

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the Microsoft ecosystem and a little bit about how you became the CEO of Pro and the XUK?

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>> Yeah, sure. I started my life as a humanities student.

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From fact about me, I've got a bachelor's in history and then a master's degree in

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ancient history.

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All that education, obviously, meant I was quite poor by the end of it.

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I used to find a job and I just fed into IT doing desktop support and stuff like that.

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Then I started to get more and more involved with the Microsoft side of things, things like

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SQL Server, .NET, C-Shop, all that sort of good stuff.

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Then for the end user that I was working with at the time, we implemented and rolled out

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Dynamics CRM 2015.

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It was service pack 2 or something like that.

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From there, I just fed in with Dynamics, started to work with that.

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Eventually, they moved across to the partner side.

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Today, yeah, I had a lead UK practice for Pro and X.

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We're a bigger partner, headquartered in Germany.

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Then around about 2017, 2016, I started to get involved in the community here in the UK,

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the Microsoft user groups.

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As a public speaker, did quite a bit of blogging and stuff like that.

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The rest is history.

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I think what's really great is that there is such a strong community on the Microsoft side,

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particularly on the business application side of things.

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There are really great people all looking to help out and get involved and to really ensure

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that people get the most out of these investments and stuff like that.

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It's been a real privilege to be involved for the blank for time that I have on making

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to new.

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Yeah.

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You heard all of the burning Microsoft's modifications, what drives your passion for

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continuous learning?

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I think it started off because I was trying to get more into doing Dynamics and things

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that were on a full time, so the basis after I implemented it for the end user.

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So, specifications for me became a really great way for me to learn about a topic, to give

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me a bit of a drive towards learning towards things and as well when it came to interviews

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at the time, when it came to potential job opportunities.

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It was a good topic that I could speak about.

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Oh, okay, I've been revising for these exams.

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I've been in my spare time.

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It's a nice conversation piece in those interviews scenarios.

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Today as well, I'm also a Microsoft certified trainer as well, so in order to be able to

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teach across, you need to have held the relevant certification.

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So for that reason, it's a good way to keep on top of what's happening, particularly

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AI, a lot of things change at the moment.

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So every week it feels like there's new things.

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Exams can be a good way of keeping it straight there.

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Yeah.

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How has being Microsoft MVP and MCD influence your career perspective on technology?

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It's really, in terms of moving my career forward, it's been quite sort of transformational

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from a technology standpoint.

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It's also been able to get a bit of a window in terms of, okay, what's happening with the

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technology.

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The most viable professionals are quite fortunate in that we're all kind of invited to an event

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every year called the MVP Summit, every in Redmond, and that gives a really good opportunity

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to get a window in terms of what Microsoft are kind of doing.

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A lot of it is under strict sort of NDA, so there's not something that we can talk about,

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but yeah, being able to have those conversations, being able to influence kind of the roadmap

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and kind of thinking there, I think is really sort of great and helps in terms of when

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we're sort of guiding and advising customers about where they need to be focused on next.

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Yeah, you are an expert on Microsoft Dynamics 365 project operations for those who aren't

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familiar with it, what exactly is it?

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So it's one of the Dynamics 365 modules.

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It's kind of a weird one.

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It's technically NERP on the ERP side of things when it comes to Dynamics, but it's actually

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mainly sort of provided through the customer engagements for the site and things as well.

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So it hosts on data verse, it's more driven app or this sort of good stuff.

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Basically, if you as an organisation are delivering or setting projects frequently, you need to

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be doing things like we're breakdown structure planning, if you need to be doing things

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like time entries, managing contracts, expenses, and drive through into sort of invoicing on

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either a pro-form or an actual sort of basis, then yeah, project operations is kind of

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the module for us for you, I would say.

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So typically we find project, professional services organisations, people who are delivering

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quite sort of big initiatives and projects, it's a really good fit there for the project

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operations kind of module.

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So yeah, as I said, it also is unique as well, because it brings in some capability from

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the Microsoft Planar side.

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So the whole planar board, task grade down board is sort of integrated very closely into

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sort of the project as well.

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So for those people who are maybe familiar working with project desktop, project operations

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for a nice way of being able to kind of, yeah, modernise what you're doing, have it stored

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in a nice sort of structured database and then benefit for a few of that, I've kind of

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just spoken about already.

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And what business problems do project operations all better than, yeah, say, traditional project

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management tools, the Microsoft earlier, a lot of tools.

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Yeah.

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So it's all about just helping deliver our projects on time and be able to manage our budgets.

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If it's quite a big initiative, you know, we can think of budgets within the application

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as well.

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The application will also support the ability to do things, to also tap into AI functionality.

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So for example, we have a few different co-pilot and agents now.

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We can generate status reports very easily.

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We've got a time entry agent that can go and automate the creation of all through a different

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sort of time entries and then manage those approval processes as well as also using co-pilot

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to go and generate work breakdown structures based on just a simple project title, description

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and all that sort of good stuff.

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So really addressing some of the common challenges that we need around managing projects,

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making sure they can be delivered well effectively, making sure that we can assign the right people

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onto the projects and have visibility around the utilization where they've been sort of

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used and averaged, because as well the application also uses the universe, the universe of resource

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scheduling, the urs functionality that you may be familiar with, things like customer service

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and field service and things like that.

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And what types of organization benefit most from implementation project operations?

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As mentioned, professional services is where we see a lot.

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So partners like us, for example, so we use project operations ourselves sort of internally.

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We also have clients as well, working in different sort of industries.

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So gas and oil, we also have other, we have examples of sort of a train organizations,

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infrastructure companies and things like that who also use it as well.

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So I think if you, as an organization, if you're delivering projects regularly, big projects

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almost to the point of maybe, you know, maybe, maybe more than thousands or maybe more

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than 40 millions of euros, then it's going to be a good fit, you'd say, to have project operations

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in the mix.

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And what, I say, some typical list conceptions organization have before, adapting the platform?

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I think that some misconceptions that they maybe have, it's kind of an interesting sort of module

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because it kind of sits between both the C and the ERP side of things.

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So maybe when they approach you for the first time, they'll say, oh, this is just one

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of the NERP apps.

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So therefore it's going to be clunky, it's going to be difficult to implement.

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It's not really for, you know, businesses of our sort of side.

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And in actual fact, you know, most of the functionality in project operations is driven

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by the customer engagements to have the platform.

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And this means that it's then leverage in all of the power platform functionality.

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So it becomes quite easy for us to go tailor, you know, create some flows, power to make

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flows, you know, modify data versus modify the data schema and to, and to extend things

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out very nicely and very easily.

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So, you know, definitely that's a big misconception around okay, how difficult it is to sort of

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roll this out in actual fact, you can deploy project operations in kind of the core mode,

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where you don't have any ERP sort of dependency.

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And then you can from there go and integrate if any ERP system that you choose or indeed

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just run it in complete isolation on the C platform.

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Yeah.

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And one of your areas of expertise is helping organizationally grade from project online,

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why are the companies are ever elevated to that to move today?

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So you may have seen the announcement you made, not a third of it.

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So hopefully it's not a huge surprise when I'm saying this, but yeah, project online is

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going to be kind of retired a little bit later on this year by the end of September is

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going to be a case that if you're still using project online and project online just

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to be clear, that's the one that's using SharePoint behind the scenes.

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There are a few different products that are quite similar, similar sort of names.

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So if you're using the project online, which is based on SharePoint, which also has a dependency

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and allows you to integrate with project desktop then after September that the solution

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will be retired and all of your data on there will then become kind of redone me.

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So if you're wanting to continue to have the same kind of functionality available, you're

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going to have to consider moving into a different sort of option.

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Microsoft have kind of got three routes that they provided or through three ways in which

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you can sort of do this.

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The first is that you can use Microsoft Planner as one solution.

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You can potentially go back on premise using project server, project server as an alternative

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or the third option and the one that's how I would recommend for obvious reasons based

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on what we described will be project operations.

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So yeah, if your organization currently relies on project online in a significant sort of

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way, then you very much need to be starting to have those conversations about how you can

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manage this transition and move across to an alternative solution.

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But they must have dynamics in the company to use project operations or...

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Cool edge, yeah.

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So for any of the options that you go down whether it's Planner, whether it's project server

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or project operations, then yeah, you need to have the licenses and all this sort of stuff.

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Going back on premise for all of this is probably not a route that I would kind of advise.

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Certainly if you're as an organization wanting to do, you start to leverage our fresh intelligence

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more.

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I think as well long term, the project server offering, I think will eventually be retired

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because there's not going to be two investments towards that sort of moving forward.

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Planner can do a pretty good job into what you sort of do.

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It does support the ability to integrate with Power Platform, but generally we find that

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for a lot of organizations who are using project online who are aligned on features like

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time entries and the more complex kind of work breakdown structure requirements, we

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tend to find that project operations provide a better long term sort of fit and means that

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you don't have to go and build a whole bunch of functionality from scratch.

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Project operations has that all sort of able for you.

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And what are the most common challenges, yeah, organization and counterburing the migration

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project?

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Data complexity, I don't know about you, I've seen pretty weird and wonderful project desktop

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MPP files in my time, you know, lots of different tasks, kind of many different sort of resource

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assignments, complex task dependencies, all of this sort of good stuff.

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So the challenge is that we tend to find usually is around the data, how can we sort of

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maybe use it as an opportunity to simplify things, it's something to be kind of aware of

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with project operations is that there are, you know, some sort of limits in terms of things

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like, okay, the number of tasks for a project, number of resource assignment support to

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task dependencies and things like that.

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So it does means that certain organizations will need to maybe look at how they're building

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their MPP files, how they're building their work breakdown structures and just see if

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there's an opportunity there to kind of simplify that because, and as well from a data migration

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standpoint, there are some considerations around that that we need to be kind of mindful

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of and again, can be another challenge here.

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So if you're wanting to, for example, take a project, take an MPP file and kind of import

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that in, you can do that in the tool that is possible to do on a project, per project desktop

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file sort of basis, but if you're wanting to migrate maybe hundreds or maybe thousands

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of different sort of projects, then you're going to have to go and automate that potentially

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and this is where we need to look at how we can leverage something known as the schedule

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API in the tool.

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Schedule API is basically will give us the ability to go and create the appropriate project

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operations like our projects, project tasks, our resource assignments and all that sort

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of good stuff because we're not allowed to in the application to go and directly write

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to those tables, we have to go through what's called the PSS sort of service, which then just

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ensures that okay, create the data, both on the data, the side and also on the planar board

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and everything is kind of correct from that sort of standpoint.

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So that can be another challenge that organizations have, okay, how can we migrate all of these

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projects in bulk, how can we successfully sort of use the schedule API in a good sort of

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way and really just ensure that we can migrate all this data successfully.

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And what data migration pitfalls, so it comes on these watch out for?

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Sorry, a couple of that questions.

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Yeah, yeah, what data migration pitfalls, so it comes on these watch out for?

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Yeah, I think it goes back to, again, as I mentioned, complexity.

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So try and just to keep, you know, keeping simple stupid, because it's always going to be

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a good thing over here.

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So use the migration opportunities to kind of simplify what you're doing.

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You know, is there a reason why your work breakdowns are so complex?

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You always need to think about things like, okay, how can we map out our resource and our

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resource profiles in a really good way in the tool?

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So we have to, for example, consider how we go and create bookable resources, how we create

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roles and skills and characteristics for those resources to represent their sort of skills

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and making sure that is also the done as well.

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Many organizations will need to ensure that they've got the appropriate dev test production

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environment configured there.

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So again, thinking about how we can kind of ensure the data is aligned accordingly, configuration

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data and all this sort of stuff is aligned.

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Who good news is that there's tooling available in the platform, things like, for example,

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the configuration migration tool that we can use to help us with that sort of process,

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but it's definitely something to think about so we can ensure that, you know, we're aligning

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data correctly.

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We can test things in the correct sort of way and that, you know, when we do our deployment

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to production, you know, all of the, all of our kind of ducks are in a row, everything is

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configured correctly for us to be successful.

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And what do us as successful and regression project look like from your perspective?

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From my perspective, if we can get all the projects to move across, if people, if project managers

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can do their job, they can go and, you know, find their projects effectively, they can assign

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their resources and they can ultimately make sure they're delivering their projects

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on time and on budget, then I think that's a pretty good success criteria for me because

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that is the key thing that the tool, the tool can support you in doing.

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And how do you approach, I say, stakeholder adaption and change management?

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And it's a great question.

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We have to always try and take people on the journey with us, you know, show them the

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benefits of the tool, engage early on with those sort of key personas, look to see what

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we can do in terms of maybe identifying some champions within the sort of company who can

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kind of help drive things sort of forward and really just focus on what we can do to make

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the user interface make the processes as easy and straightforward as possible.

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And this is a good thing about the fact that we can tap into the power platform, you know,

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it's possible for us to go and build out these custom interfaces, you know, we can use

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technologies like, for example, custom pages to make the fly day more streamlined interface

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with what we have now from an AI standpoint is possible for us to maybe do things like,

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you know, build, you know, vibe out, you know, applications, build out some web interfaces

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that can then be sort of then taken forward.

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And then again, can really simplify things from that sort of standpoint.

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So it's going to be important that we sort of look at each sort of organization's processes,

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try and align to what the tool supports natively out the boxes, which is possible.

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But then beyond that, using what we have in the power platform to, you know, do those deviations

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away, make it easy and straightforward for the company question for the users to be able

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to get the job done.

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Yeah, can you share a memorial number, the recreation success story or lesson to learn without

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explaining the client?

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Yeah, we have one of our U.S. clients that this has done.

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I wasn't involved myself in the project as one of my team members, sort of colleagues, but

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yeah, we were able to in the end migrate across all the projects.

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We built out a whole bunch of scripting that's targeted the scheduled API.

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We were able to then ensure that that was then able to be run repeatedly.

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And we were able to sort of do over several different kind of iterations, you know, test

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migrations and things like that.

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So, you know, there in the end, we were able to sort of get everything migrated across successfully.

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We've no sort of issues, the fact that we were able to, you know, make those scripting,

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make those scripts sort of repeatable, really kind of helped us a part of that.

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We could very quickly and easily, you know, spin up an environment run the scripts, check

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to see if there's anything sort of work there.

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And as well, we were able to handle the sheer volume of data by, you know, by making sure

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these scripts could be run, you know, in a virtual environment can be run in the background

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that stuff I've got.

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And to be sure, they're targeting the supported APIs that Microsoft give, you know, the schedule

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API and things like that.

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And there are, I don't know, something or companies can prepare for a successful migration

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project.

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I think it's going to be a case of looking at what you have from a, from an MPP, from

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a project, desktop sort of standpoint.

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So Microsoft, you provide some resources online that sort of talks through a KB, what is

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supported, what isn't supported, when we're sort of migrating things.

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So looking at that very carefully is going to be, is going to be useful as part of your

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sort of processes.

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And as well, just try and use it as an opportunity to simplify things.

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And maybe as well challenge the ways of working a KB, well, why are we having such complex

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work breakdown structures?

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You know, why are we having, you know, so many different sort of resource assignments,

295
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you know, do we need to have this level of complexity from a dependency standpoint?

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I think it's, it's always a good opportunity as part of any migration to actually take

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a step back and actually critically look at, okay, you know, is there a good business

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reason why we're doing things this way?

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Or is it, are we just doing this, doing this, this way because we've always done it and

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we don't want to rock the boat or cause any problems by deviating away from that?

301
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Yeah, I see, although Microsoft is, yeah, embedding it across every application.

302
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Yeah, exactly.

303
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Well, how do you see a eye-transforming project operations, especially?

304
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I think I mentioned some of the functionalities already, so I quite like at the moment things

305
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like the time entry agent, which is a really good use case there because, you know, it's

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for organizations like ours, partners, you know, a pressurization organizations, you know,

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time entries, having to do all of that on a week to week basis.

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It's, it's, it's the job that we hate, but the job that we have to do in order to be

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able to sort of, you know, ensure that we can invoice and, you know, generate revenue

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for the business.

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And so the great thing about the time entry agent is that it can automate a lot of those

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key sort of steps.

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It can go and look at, you know, what we have in terms of our existing resource assignments,

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our outlook appointments.

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It can go and preemptively sort of generate those time entries in kind of a draft form,

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based on, you know, what it thinks we're going to be doing and working on from there, the

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agent can then sort of come to life at the right point of the week and sort of say,

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hey, hey, Joe, here are your time entries for the week ahead.

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Go and review them, make sure they look okay, and then go and submit them from there.

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And as well, the agent can then handle the, okay, chasing up with people, you know, if

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I've not done anything there, you know, after a few days, you can just go knock on my door

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and go, Joe, you need to go and submit your time entries.

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You know, so really reducing the need for somebody, for, you know, somebody in the

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organization to have to go around and basically chase everyone for that information.

325
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Once the time entry is then submitted in the tool itself, we can then configure additional

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artificial intelligence capability to then handle the approvals process and that can

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be done based on a policy document and then the agent can just go and preemptively sort

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of approve or reject time entries, you know, as long as it meets the criteria, the boundaries

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for all positions.

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So these are usually very laborious processes, very time intensive sort of processes, you

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know, requiring human intervention, sort of do this and all this can now become a automated

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quite massive agent.

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So I really like the potential there that that sort of shows for the technology.

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So those helps, especially in resource planning, as they're also, I say, co-pilot for forecasting

335
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a project.

336
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Yeah, so there's tools there in terms of being able to generate the status reports, we can

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also do things like get suggestions for resources.

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So when we're going and planning for a project, we can basically get a list of people who

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we think are going to be a good fit based on previous sort of project performance, based

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on their current availability and we get kind of like a scorecard there that kind of just

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allow the outlines in terms of what is possible there.

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So a lot of investments going into the air from charity at the moment, particularly for

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project operations.

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So I think the future is going to be quite exciting in terms of what we see in future.

345
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Yeah.

346
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I think also, I don't know, it's possible, but I think it's also be awesome if AI can help

347
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to see project risk or risk, I think that's good also be an interesting case for AI.

348
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Yeah.

349
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So it does that stay actually.

350
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So at any point when the project's in delivery, you can go in and basically generate a series

351
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of risks for the project, it goes and looks at the data in the tool already, it looks at

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the assignments, the time entries, what's been submitted, whether we're close to budget

353
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or over budget and stuff like that and then we'll go and generate those risks for you.

354
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So that is a feature that's been there for a while now and can be sort of an excuse at

355
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any time.

356
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So.

357
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,800
Yeah, that's interesting.

358
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And what will you say place the power platform and yeah, I say extending a product

359
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operations.

360
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:55,760
It's an important component and one that we do very often on projects here.

361
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So having all of that power platform functionality there are feet means that we can go and for

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example, if we want to build an external website that allows maybe contractors to go and

363
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submit time entries, we can use power pages to build that out.

364
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:14,840
If we need a more complex report, we can go and use power BI to help us with that.

365
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:19,760
As mentioned already, we can do database schema level changes quite sort of easy and straight

366
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forwardly into the database and then go and build out custom app interfaces using power apps.

367
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So a lot of potential there to use the power platform and it really just help us, you know,

368
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when we need to sort of tear the application for more specific needs.

369
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And how did we handle governance and compliance, especially in project operation?

370
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So all of that, if again, falls back onto the power platform, sort of capability.

371
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So we know that for example, we can use features like data, cross prevention policies to allow

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to allow certain connectors.

373
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We know that we've got the full capabilities of data, versus from a role-based actors control

374
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standpoint.

375
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So we can use things like business units, security roles, teams, we can even encrypt specific

376
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columns using column security, sort of profiles.

377
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And then we know that, you know, at the power platform level, at the app, in central level,

378
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these are just data versus environments.

379
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So everything the data versus gives us things like managing environments, fees like pipelines,

380
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:24,400
a handler application, lifecycle management processes, you know, all of that is immediately

381
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sort of supported, you know, with no additional sort of hurdle that we have to go over.

382
00:26:30,360 --> 00:26:31,360
Yeah.

383
00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:37,880
And I think, you know, we have co-pilot studio, or I think really new is co-pilot scout,

384
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I think, with the agents.

385
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:46,800
Because they are also a capability for this in, yeah, in project operations.

386
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:47,800
Yeah.

387
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,560
So co-pilot studio, we can go build on custom agents.

388
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,560
We think we can go and connect that into data versus directly.

389
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:57,120
So for more specific scenarios that we want to work with, then it becomes very easy to

390
00:26:57,120 --> 00:26:58,840
build those out as well.

391
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,040
All of the first party agents that Microsoft provide to us.

392
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So for example, time entry agent that I mentioned sort of before, that can also be customized

393
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:08,280
as well by us.

394
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:12,480
If we want to go and extend things out, maybe have some additional scenarios that the

395
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:19,000
time entry agent can sort of support, then we can go and do that very easily, very straightforward.

396
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:26,960
And did you think the AI could also become a project manager, or is there a need for human

397
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,080
in the loop?

398
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,800
I think we're moving into that direction, the technology, you can date today, certainly

399
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:34,040
sort of support it.

400
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,000
I think, you know, it's always going to be a case that we need to have these processes

401
00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:42,120
for the auditable, where there will be certain scenarios where we do need to get human approval

402
00:27:42,120 --> 00:27:43,120
there.

403
00:27:43,120 --> 00:27:47,440
Maybe if it is a sort of a scenario that we don't see too often, maybe an edge case sort

404
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:50,120
of process, things like that.

405
00:27:50,120 --> 00:27:54,880
But yeah, I think it's possible that, you know, for PMO type level roles, you know, for

406
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,000
somebody, somebody who's maybe working in the PMO office who's responsible for just

407
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:03,360
going and chasing sort of time entries, you know, that sort of function can be sort of

408
00:28:03,360 --> 00:28:04,360
eliminated.

409
00:28:04,360 --> 00:28:08,240
We're still going to need to have the project manager kind of involved there.

410
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:12,720
It's going to hopefully allow them to be in a situation where they can manage, you know,

411
00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:16,880
things on maybe a 10X basis, so they can manage more projects more easily.

412
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,960
And using AI to kind of just help them help them to manage all of that, you know, at a much

413
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:21,960
more grand scale.

414
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:29,600
If Microsoft comes tomorrow and says, hey, Joe, you get all the money you need, the employees,

415
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:36,800
what feature will you, the Vennel in the next 65 project operations?

416
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,600
Oh, that is a good question.

417
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:50,720
I would certainly like to have to think now, actually, I think there's definitely some

418
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:55,760
good stuff coming in terms of the field service integration, which is looking quite sort

419
00:28:55,760 --> 00:29:05,200
of good. It would be really nice to sort of have it sort of tailor out some aspects of the

420
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:06,200
plan aboard.

421
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:07,200
Yeah.

422
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:11,440
So to be able to support additional sort of capabilities, we often see that, yeah, the

423
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,520
planning capabilities are not quite on a power of project desktop.

424
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:18,760
So I probably focus my attention on trying to make that a bit more sort of expansive, make

425
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:23,480
it easier for us to maybe go and export our into project desktop and then go and import

426
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:28,480
back into the tool because those are kind of the scenarios that we see a lot of project managers

427
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:29,880
wanted to do very regularly.

428
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,280
I think we would make them happy if they could do that.

429
00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:38,320
And yeah, your expertise also include the Azure integrations, what will do as a play

430
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:41,760
and a modern project operation solution?

431
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:46,120
So very often if we are doing more complex kind of integrations, more complex things involving

432
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:50,920
the schedule API where we need to go and perhaps create a whole bunch of project tasks

433
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:55,520
or resource assignments and things like that, then what we can do is we can offload that processing

434
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:56,880
into Azure.

435
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,520
We can have, for example, Azure Wear plug-ins.

436
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:04,080
We can tap into Azure Service Bus for a synchronous sort of processing and then from there go

437
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:09,480
and have that sort of scale there to be able to handle those more complex integrations.

438
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,000
As well, if we're typically, we've done this for a few projects, if we're integrating

439
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:17,840
with external ERP systems, then again, Azure allows us to build out the patterns and the

440
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:22,240
frameworks to be able to handle those sort of integrations, be able to process them, be

441
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:26,360
able to scale them accordingly, and also as well to be able to ensure that we've got that

442
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,040
traceability for every change that we're doing.

443
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:33,680
We can ensure it's processed in your first in first out type of order.

444
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:37,360
Again, using Service Bus and other tools to handle that.

445
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:43,480
And how do you balance our customizations with maintaining a supportable and scalable

446
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:44,480
architecture?

447
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:48,560
Yeah, sometimes you do have to push back.

448
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:54,040
Try and make sure that we can fit the process around the sort of system as much as possible.

449
00:30:54,040 --> 00:31:01,240
And where necessary deviate away and use supported customizations only, so use Power Platform.

450
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:05,280
Don't be writing custom code, don't be writing plug-ins too often.

451
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,680
You don't be using JavaScript and things like that.

452
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:12,600
Use the supported accessibility points within the Power Platform, the ability to customize

453
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,880
forms and views and stuff like that.

454
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,360
And that would just mean that we have an easier road.

455
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:20,920
And as well as solution would just become a lot more easily maintainable as well for the

456
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,920
end customer, which is going to help with adoption.

457
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:31,360
Yeah, what are the trends in Dynamics 365 and Business Application?

458
00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:35,760
Yeah, we should prepare for now.

459
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:40,440
Really interesting sort of place at the moment because, you know, anybody who's got GitHub

460
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:44,920
code pilot could go spend a weekend and they could go and vibe code themselves their own

461
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:46,240
sort of CRM sort of system.

462
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,680
You know, it's possible today with the technology to kind of do that.

463
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:52,040
So then the obvious question from there kind of made us, okay, well, why do we still need

464
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:53,040
SAS?

465
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:54,720
You know, is SAS dead?

466
00:31:54,720 --> 00:32:00,240
Some people keep claiming as part of that, you know, when we can just build our own apps,

467
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:03,520
our own sort of things that we can then sort of run from there.

468
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:08,440
I still think that, you know, although we can do a lot in terms of building our own bespoke

469
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:12,400
apps and things like that, you know, there is still, you know, potentially huge gaps there,

470
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:17,880
gaps there for things like security gaps there in terms of, okay, how is the app actually scalable,

471
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,320
is it able to support all of that?

472
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:24,720
So very much think that, you know, there's still going to be a place for having, you know,

473
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:29,400
a platform that's going to give you all of that, you know, so potential future I could

474
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:34,480
foresee is, you know, okay, well, you know, you can vibe code your apps, but then you're

475
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:39,600
using the Microsoft sort of offering and solution to basically host that and Microsoft

476
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:44,680
then provides you with the ability with coverage, you know, they'll make sure that thing that

477
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:49,120
secure authentication is in place, they'll make sure that maybe any smells, any problems

478
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:53,680
with your code are kind of fixed, you know, it closed any sort of security, you know, that

479
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:58,320
could be potentially a future that we could see with this sort of platform, certainly

480
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,200
it's based on whether technology is looking, how the technology is looking today and where

481
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,200
the future could be?

482
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:10,800
But when the company will start their journey in project operations, what is the first

483
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:13,960
recommendation you can give them?

484
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:19,800
First recommendation is to look at the app, the box process, focus on that as much as possible,

485
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:25,320
see how we can align towards that as much as sort of possible and sort of, you know, prepare

486
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:31,160
yourself to, you know, to keep things as simple as straightforward as possible, you know, as

487
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:35,480
if any of these sort of, you know, SaaS sort of products, the more we can deviate away from

488
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:39,640
the standard functionality, the more potential challenges and risks that we may see in the project

489
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:40,640
itself.

490
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,600
So just try and make sure we can align to what is there as much as possible and deviate

491
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:49,440
away only if there's a good business reason, business justification for doing so.

492
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:55,440
And I think when we think about AI, there are a lot of company, they, yeah, they don't see

493
00:33:55,440 --> 00:34:05,360
the real outcomes of AI, how can we measure the outcomes from AI or what the RKBI is

494
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:08,160
or how can we measure it?

495
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:12,880
It's going to be driven by probably, you know, cost saving, time saving, you know, usually

496
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:18,080
there's a distinction between OK, the amount of money we save, the amount of time we save,

497
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,080
our target time is money.

498
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,040
So, you know, having that sort of fair comparison there, if we can demonstrate technologies

499
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:30,360
made up huge impact from a time saving standpoint, if we can show that the technology has allowed

500
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:35,920
us to process more work, you know, handle more caseload, deliver our projects more on time,

501
00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:39,960
more on budget, things like that, you know, these are kind of the, the sweet spot metrics

502
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:43,840
that we want to be sort of looking towards, you know, how can we, how is the technology

503
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:51,000
helped us to improve our delivery of a certain sort of function and how is that then resulted

504
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:55,080
in, you know, more positive experience for even the businesses or for the customers that

505
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:56,800
were sort of working with?

506
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:05,640
Yeah, we have also, I think the co-pilot, but that's also, as I foundry, what role plays

507
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:10,280
the as I foundry in, in, in, in, in integration?

508
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:15,440
So, Microsoft foundry, that would be probably for scenarios where OK, you need to have more

509
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:20,080
control, maybe you're taking more of a pro code sort of routes for our purposes, you know,

510
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:25,440
if you are maybe an ISV independent software vendor, you wanted to build agents that you

511
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,720
want to then sort of make available to end customers, then if for me, foundry is probably

512
00:35:29,720 --> 00:35:32,160
the option that you want to be considering as part of that.

513
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:36,800
So, we're doing a lot of investigations into that at the moment in terms of OK, how we

514
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:41,040
can potentially leverage users' technology, it will be maybe kind of a sort of watch this

515
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:45,960
space around all this, but certainly with foundry, you get a lot in terms of your additional

516
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:51,040
capability, the ability to really tailor your agent experience, I think as well, the ability

517
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:56,040
to, you know, use the model that's best for your particular scenario, you know, so it may

518
00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:00,600
be that OK, the opening eye models are not good, not sufficient for what you need, maybe

519
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,040
there's a specific, you know, a throttbit model, there's a specific, maybe deep seek or

520
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:06,680
grock model that's going to be more preferable for you.

521
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:10,720
And as well in the foundry side, you can start to do things like maybe fine tuning the model

522
00:36:10,720 --> 00:36:14,320
as well, train it on your own business data, and therefore it's then going to be a lot

523
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,520
more valuable, you can then reduce your token costs and stuff like that.

524
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:22,240
So those are some of the advantages that I see that foundry bringing to the equation.

525
00:36:22,240 --> 00:36:31,120
And how organizations combine dynamics, project operations with fabric, data wells and

526
00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:36,480
Azure, did you think it will be an only fine solution in the future?

527
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:37,480
I think so.

528
00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:40,040
And that's again, indeed, the advantage of relying for Microsoft standpoint because we

529
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:44,680
can very easy, for example, can figure fabric thing from our data, the environment and then

530
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:50,640
get that data out into fabric, fabric then becomes kind of our principle and central knowledge

531
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:55,640
source for everything to do in the organization and can then be used by any agents that we

532
00:36:55,640 --> 00:37:01,920
create in order to be able to sort of answer questions about the organization itself.

533
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:07,880
So certainly, you know, if you're thinking about how to adopt AI, well, it just requires

534
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:12,640
maybe to take a bit of a step back, sort of say, okay, well, you know, maybe we need to first

535
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:17,000
implement fabric, maybe we need to first make sure we're implementing power platform,

536
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:20,960
well, you know, look at all the different core elements, foundational elements, they're

537
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:22,680
going to be successful.

538
00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:26,320
And then from there, once they're in place, you can then sort of proceed and move forward

539
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:31,280
and really deliver and start building these agente experiences with the best possible

540
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:34,880
chance of success.

541
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:47,600
And then, yeah, what did you think, how accurate, actually, a algorithm, yeah, tools around Microsoft,

542
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:54,640
are they really enterprise ready or is it more, I say, gamey vacation?

543
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:55,640
I think it's getting there.

544
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:59,040
I think, you know, in terms of when we're looking at all the events at the moment, I think

545
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,560
certainly Microsoft is, is I think head of the game there in terms of the art thinking

546
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:07,400
about all this stuff and they are providing the tools to help support us as part of this,

547
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,840
you know, whether it's your things like the responsible AI principles, whether it's the

548
00:38:10,840 --> 00:38:16,000
co-part of control system, agent 365, which is now currently in G.A., you know, they consistently

549
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:20,440
thinking about, okay, what can we do from a technology standpoint to ensure that we can,

550
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:25,360
you know, you know, and so the enterprises can sort of move forward, they can adopt this

551
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:30,280
technology, you know, in at the pace that's going to suit them and that we've got all the

552
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:34,240
appropriate protections to ensure that, okay, we can manage things like, you know, potential

553
00:38:34,240 --> 00:38:38,520
jail breaking of agents, we can handle risks around maybe data security and all this sort

554
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:39,520
of good stuff.

555
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,720
I think consistently, Microsoft are, you know, are always thinking in those sort of terms

556
00:38:43,720 --> 00:38:48,560
and providing the broad framework and the broad tools to help address those challenges.

557
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:49,560
Yeah.

558
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:50,560
Okay.

559
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,960
Let's jump in the quick fire round.

560
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:59,960
So I asked you, yeah, I give the question and you, yeah, you'll give what we're going

561
00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:03,400
on what comes on your mind.

562
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:08,560
So what's the most underrated Dynamics 365 feature?

563
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:16,240
Oh, most of the research that I feature, I would say business rules, I love business rules,

564
00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:18,880
means we have to record some code.

565
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:24,760
What was your most exciting Microsoft announcement in the last 12 months?

566
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:35,960
What was exciting Microsoft announcement?

567
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:42,480
Which Microsoft product will survive longest on the zombie apocalypse?

568
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,200
Probably Microsoft paint.

569
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:46,200
Okay.

570
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:47,200
Yeah.

571
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,200
Coffee tea or energy drinks during implementation?

572
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:51,200
Oh, tea.

573
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:52,200
Tea.

574
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:53,200
I'm from the UK.

575
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:58,280
Tea, milk, no sugar, and then that'll get you free tea in the day.

576
00:39:58,280 --> 00:39:59,280
Okay.

577
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:07,600
What was the do you think helped you more in your career, the MVP status only in the city?

578
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:13,760
I would say being an MVP for sure based on the opportunities that's given me.

579
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:21,840
And yeah, if you will start a new startup, what, what do you do?

580
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:28,800
It would probably be focused around AI adoption, advisory, and how we can sort of, as I mentioned,

581
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:32,640
best set the foundations for success here.

582
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:39,560
Architech, draw the other grums or documentation?

583
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:45,760
Documentation, I do like a good, thank you for your documentation.

584
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:47,240
What, what, what, what did you think?

585
00:40:47,240 --> 00:40:52,600
What's longer than the dynamic implementation or a Marvel movie, Marlton?

586
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:54,080
Oh, oh, good.

587
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:56,600
Well, there's quite a lot of Marvel movies now.

588
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:57,960
I probably have to say the Marvel one.

589
00:40:57,960 --> 00:40:58,960
There's so many now.

590
00:40:58,960 --> 00:40:59,960
Yeah.

591
00:40:59,960 --> 00:41:05,640
So if you were to take what career will you have to choose?

592
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:10,440
I would probably be one of those guys that you see doing like history walking tours in

593
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,040
like York, or London in a costume.

594
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:17,200
So maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe that's what I do when I retire.

595
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:18,640
Yeah.

596
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:24,080
And what's your, yeah, I say go to productivity hack?

597
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,520
Go to productivity hack.

598
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:34,360
I really like, I put my headphones on and I usually get a podcast or some music on and

599
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,240
that gets me really focused.

600
00:41:37,240 --> 00:41:40,960
And yeah, what, what's higher?

601
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:45,400
Stakeholder management or technical architecture?

602
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:50,960
Stakeholder management for sure, making sure people on the train with you.

603
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:55,920
What's the full thing when you do a start a new project?

604
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:01,200
First thing I do, yeah, make sure, have an aspect, introduce everyone and yeah, share some

605
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:05,240
from facts, get the team, get the team on the same page.

606
00:42:05,240 --> 00:42:08,440
And yeah, really sort of excited to do the project.

607
00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:09,440
Awesome.

608
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:10,440
Yeah, thank you.

609
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:12,880
This was, yeah, this was, I really enjoyed it.

610
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:14,200
This was really fun.

611
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:20,400
Yeah, and yeah, for me, it's a, it's a complete new tool, the project operation.

612
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:26,040
So yeah, I say, yeah, thank you, Joe, for, for joining me today and sharing your insights

613
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:32,000
on Dynamics 365 project operations, Regretion, Stagebreeze, Azure in, and yeah, integrations

614
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,400
and the future of AI project delivery.

615
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:41,600
Yeah, I think, yeah, if listeners want to learn more about Joe or pro MX or Dynamics 365

616
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:47,280
operations, they can look into the show notes and see all your links.

617
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:54,760
And yeah, yeah, so until next time, keep learning, keep building and keep exploring what

618
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:56,160
possible was Microsoft technology.

619
00:42:56,160 --> 00:42:58,360
So thank you for, for being here.

620
00:42:58,360 --> 00:43:00,400
Yeah, always thanks, we go.

621
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:01,400
Appreciate it.

622
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:02,400
Thank you.

623
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:03,400
Okay, goodbye.

624
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:04,400
Ciao.

625
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:05,400
Ciao.

626
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:06,400
Bye.